Greek Texts & Translations

Quite so.

Is the dissolution of a kingdom, or of any government that has ever yet been dissolved, caused by any other agency than that of the rulers themselves? Or, though we made this assertion a moment ago when we happened upon this subject, have we now forgotten it? ^note

How could we possibly have forgotten?

Shall we further confirm that assertion now? For we have come to the same view now, as it appears, in dealing with facts of history; so that we shall be examining it with reference not to a mere abstraction, 684abut to real events. Now what actually took place was this: each of the three royal houses, and the cities under their sway, swore to one another, ^note according to the laws, binding alike on ruler and subject, which they had made,—the rulers that, as time went on and the nation advanced, they would refrain from making their rule more severe, and the subjects that, so long as the rulers kept fast to their promise, they would never upset the monarchy themselves, nor would they allow others to do so; and they swore that the kings should aid both kings and peoples 684bwhen wronged, and the peoples aid both peoples and kings. Was not that the way of it?

It was.

In the polities legally established—whether by the kings or others—in the three States, was not this the most important principle?

What?

That the other two States should always help against the third, whenever it disobeyed the laws laid down.

Evidently.

And surely most people insist on this,— 684cthat the lawgivers shall enact laws of such a kind that the masses of the people accept them willingly; just as one might insist that trainers or doctors should make their treatments or cures of men's bodies pleasurable.

Exactly so.

But in fact one often has to be content if one can bring a body into a sound and healthy state with no great amount of pain.

Very true. 684d

The men of that age possessed also another advantage which helped not a little to facilitate legislation. ^note

What was that?

Their legislators, in their efforts to establish equality of property, were free from that worst of accusations which is commonly incurred in States with laws of a different kind, whenever anyone seeks to disturb the occupation of land, or to propose the abolition of debts, since he perceives that without these measures equality could never be fully secured. In such cases, if the lawgiver attempts to disturb any of these things, 684eeveryone confronts him with the cry, “Hands off,” and they curse him for introducing redistributions of land and remissions of debts, with the result that every man is rendered powerless. But the Dorians had this further advantage, that they were free from all dread of giving offence, so that they could divide up their land without dispute; and they had no large debts of old standing. ^note

True

How was it then, my good sirs, that their settlement and legislation turned out so badly? 685a

What do you mean? What fault have you to find with it?

This, that whereas there were three States settled, two of the three ^note speedily wrecked their constitution and their laws, and one only remained stable—and that was your State, Megillus.

The question is no easy one.

Yet surely in our consideration and enquiry into this subject, indulging in an old man's sober play with laws, we ought to proceed on our journey 685bpainlessly, as we said ^note when we first started out.

Certainly, we must do as you say.

Well, what laws would offer a better subject for investigation than the laws by which those States were regulated? Or what larger or more famous States are there about whose settling we might enquire?

It would be hard to mention better instances than these.

It is fairly evident that the men of that age intended this organization of theirs to serve as an adequate protection 685cnot only for the Peloponnesus, but for the whole of Hellas as well, in case any of the barbarians should attack them just as the former dwellers around Ilium were emboldened to embark on the Trojan War through reliance on the Assyrian power as it had been in the reign of Ninus. ^note For much of the splendor of that empire still survived and the people of that age stood in fear of its confederate power, just as we men of today dread the Great King. For since Troy was a part of the Assyrian empire, the second ^note capture of Troy